Cold start juddering and anti pollution message

[Tomlinjohn]

Hi
Our recently acquired 53 reg, 206cc 2.0 has a judder when started from cold. The tachometer doesn't fluctuate but it feels like the engine is running rough. The engine does rock about, not sure if it's a misfire or a mounting and cold tick over is 1000rpm.

Then today I set off for work and after a mile the 'catalytic converter fault' flashed up along with EML them the 'anti pollution fault' message, is the juddering and the pollution known connected faults?

Would a53reg have the problematic tappets?

I have 'planet' and will read and report the codes after work.

[Capncol]

Post up the codes and we can point you in the right direction.
Unlikely to be tappets as the weathers too warm. (Unless car is in Iceland or Siberia)

[Tomlinjohn]

Hi
I plugged in planet and the only fault was 'misfire cylinder number 2'
The code is P1338
I have tried an injector test and coil 1/3 & 2/4 tests, no faults.

Start with the plugs ?

[gazza82]

Could be a plug breaking down. I found the 2.0 likes the Bosch Super 4 plugs ... there is a known issue with some coilpacks and NGK plugs ...

[Tomlinjohn]

I replaced the plugs but with new Bosch ones however the juddering/misfire was still there on start up. I then replaced the coil pack and the tick over seems smooth, so fingers crossed. I will know for sure tomorrow after a cold start.

[Tomlinjohn]

Back to square 1 !!!
Started the car this morning and it ticked over around 1200 rpm, then slowed to 1000rpm, within 30 seconds the juddering returned. Again tachometer is steady but the car judders, gear wobbles etc. Wife set off to work and then rang to say 'anti pollution' and EML on again, so not the plugs or coil pack !
Help anyone?

Codes are permanent misfire cylinder 2 (p0302) and intermittent misfire cylinder 2 (p1388)

[Capncol]

Is it the same fault code? How did you carry out the injector test? Have you got an air leak? can you swap no2 injector with another cylinder?

[Tomlinjohn]

Amendment to last post codes are p0302 and p1338 (not p1388)

Yes they are the same codes and symptoms. When started from warm the car doesn't judder.

The injection clicking test was in Planet.

I thought about a vacuum or air leak, but why is the code just for cylinder 2?

I will try swapping injector number 2 with another and see if the code reading changes, keep wondering about the numerous posts on tappett issues ?

[GrandadMonkey]

As Capncol has stated, the cars with the well known hydraulic tappet issue usually present their symptoms in the cold autumn / winter months rather than during the warm summer months.

It seems right to point you to checking the injector. Either the injector itself or the electrical connections to it. However, according to other threads, injector problems often seem to present their symptoms at higher revs rather than at than tickover.

[Tomlinjohn]

Hi
I have swapped injectors 2 & 3 and started the car, it still judders when cold but I can't get the EML to come on yet, hence can't get a fault code.
Could it be the tappets on this year car?

[Capncol]

Seeing as you keep asking about tappets-
The tappets are pumped up by oil pressure to take up the slack between the cam follower and valve. This means they *self adjust* The original spec tappets didn't bleed off the excess oil quickly enough, and if the oil was thick (cold weather, or wrong oil used) the excess pressure would *jack up* the tappets, hold the valves from seating properly, and cause random misfires.

Your misfire is confined to cyl 2, and the oil will be thin at this time of year, so that really suggests something other than tappets. It's not a cheap fix either, so doesn't it make sense to rule out the cheaper, easier to fix stuff first?

Right, you now need to re-scan and see if fault has moved to cyl3.

[Tomlinjohn]

Completely agree, always the simplest and cheapest first. Having just removed/replaced the intake cam shaft to reseal the leaking carrier, I really don't want to do it again (although the tappets have 50% off at Eurocar !)
I was hoping for the EML to show itself today but no look yet, will try tomorrow am.

I bought the car with the abs light on and scanned it with planet looking for the abs issue. The misfire cylinder 2 was there but I ignored it, as it drove home ok and without the EML. The car has been garaged since then as I did the cam belt, oil leak and abs etc and as only just been brought back into use. I can only assume the juddering was there when I bought the car as the fault code was stored in the ECU. Also the coil pack I replaced was an aftermarket part so I suspect the p/o had been chasing this issue?

[Tomlinjohn]

Still juddering on cold start and no EML but it did pass it's MOT inc the emission test.

[bobski]

did you ever sort the juddering on start up, Ive just bought a 206cc 2L low millage and does the same as yours, I don't have a code reader but runs fine when it's warmed up