Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

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wizlinkx
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Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by wizlinkx »

Capncol wrote:With modern fuel & oils, carbon build up isn't the problem it used to be. it will do no harm leaving it.
OK. Thanks Capncol and IanL.

Update: Took the head to engineering shop. They checked and said need to replace all the valves and valve stem seals. I bought the material and gave. They did the valve seating, replacing the stem seals and valves, and cleaned the head. Not satisfied with the level of cleaning :), but it's ok. Think it needs polishing. Labour cost of $117.00, All 16 valves + 16 Stem seals cost $264.00.
2006 206CC TU5JP4 NFU, 1.6l, 16v engine, Tiptronic, 184.000 Kilometers, Automatic A/C.

wizlinkx
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Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:59 am
Location: Dubai, United Arab Emirates

Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by wizlinkx »

Hi guys, it's been a long time. Hope you are doing fine.
about a month and two weeks.
Holiday season's around the corner :santa:

Brought the head back long time ago. Took time to get the parts, work and stuff, and then fell ill.

Started on the engine yesterday. Cleaning the mating surface of the block. But rusted too. lots scotch brit and elbow grease.

Want some input on the amount of torque when tightening the intake and exhaust nuts.

I believe the head bolts has to be 15nm then 120 degree turns in two successions. Starting each bolt from center and going in a roundish fashion.

Your expert advice is appreciated guys.

Thank you.
2006 206CC TU5JP4 NFU, 1.6l, 16v engine, Tiptronic, 184.000 Kilometers, Automatic A/C.

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Capncol
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Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by Capncol »

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Cheers Col.


206cc 1.6ltr (Wifes toy)
Mercedes ML (workhorse)
Corvette C3 (my toy)

When requesting help of a technical nature, please give as much detail of the fault as possible along with details of exact model, engine size & type, gearbox, year, mileage, and any relevant work carried out to try to solve the problem to help us help you.
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wizlinkx
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Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by wizlinkx »

Thank you CapNcol. This is great.
2006 206CC TU5JP4 NFU, 1.6l, 16v engine, Tiptronic, 184.000 Kilometers, Automatic A/C.

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gazza82
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Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by gazza82 »

Are you fitting new head bolts? If not, carefully measure them as they stretch.
Family Fleet: ex-Cayman Green 206 CC 2.0 LE, Indigo Blue 206 1.4 HDi Hatchback, Subaru BRZ Auto, Alfa Romeo MiTo

wizlinkx
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Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by wizlinkx »

New head bolts, new head gasket, new intake rubber seals, new cam belt kit.
2006 206CC TU5JP4 NFU, 1.6l, 16v engine, Tiptronic, 184.000 Kilometers, Automatic A/C.

wizlinkx
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Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by wizlinkx »

My only fear was the head fitment. Just taking all necessary precautions such as making certain the mating surfaces are free of any lube, including oil in the hand (wearing surgical gloves before placing the head gasket). May be i'm being paranoid. But placing the head is right on alignment is a one time thing. No wiggle room.

I couldn't keep to holding the weight with the exhaust and the inlet on. So removed the inlet and placed the head. Put two bolts thru the head (top left most and right most) and while my wife was monitoring the bolts falling on to the proper holes, managed to seat it without any movement.

Next Cam followers, sprockets, Cam belt, timing etc. Guess I can start the car tonight.

You guys must be thinking I'm some crazy newbie :). Yes I'm. But I love the sweat, and the results.

Always thank you for your expert input guys.
2006 206CC TU5JP4 NFU, 1.6l, 16v engine, Tiptronic, 184.000 Kilometers, Automatic A/C.

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Capncol
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Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by Capncol »

Make sure pistons are 1/2 way down the bores before TDC No1+4 cyls. Fit the cams etc in the TDC No1 position and then turn crank to TDC and put the belt on. Save inadvertently bending valves if you have any pistons at TDC when you fit the cams.
Cheers Col.


206cc 1.6ltr (Wifes toy)
Mercedes ML (workhorse)
Corvette C3 (my toy)

When requesting help of a technical nature, please give as much detail of the fault as possible along with details of exact model, engine size & type, gearbox, year, mileage, and any relevant work carried out to try to solve the problem to help us help you.
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wizlinkx
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Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by wizlinkx »

Capncol wrote:Make sure pistons are 1/2 way down the bores before TDC No1+4 cyls. Fit the cams etc in the TDC No1 position and then turn crank to TDC and put the belt on. Save inadvertently bending valves if you have any pistons at TDC when you fit the cams.

Gosh, then I may have screwed it up.
I was following this http://www.peugeot206cc.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=11459 post and its pictures.

According to the pictures, the scribed line crank pulley must face toward the ground while the sprockets are locked. Then put the belt with its marks aligning the crank pulley and the cams. Then release the pin on the tensioner. Turn the crank manually twice to make certain the marks on the belt returns to the exact position where it was placed.

I haven't yet put the belt, but already installed the cam followers and sprockets, cam follower cover etc etc.

Did I mess it up?

Ok, am beginning to realize that post must be for a periodic maintenance. What have I've done?

Missed your post by about 5 hours while I was fitting the cam followers.

I had the scribed mark on the crank pointed all way to the ground. So that means cylinder 2+3 was on TDC while I was fixing the cams. And that means I bent the valves on 2 and 3. Shit.
2006 206CC TU5JP4 NFU, 1.6l, 16v engine, Tiptronic, 184.000 Kilometers, Automatic A/C.

wizlinkx
Posts: 62
Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:59 am
Location: Dubai, United Arab Emirates

Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by wizlinkx »

Hi guys.

Just want to let you know, The car started up. I don't think this means everything went well.

I'll try a compression test. probably will know if any valves were bent during the installation.

Initially when I gave the car to that garage, they had broken the passenger side engine mount.

There's an usual sound coming from the right side intake cam followers. may be normal.

Also the engine sounds bassy. Bit of vibration. I'm guessing it could be due to the broken engine mount.

The tail pipe isn't throwing white or black smoke. Check engine light on continuously. I'll check with my diagnostic reader and see. I think that came up originally when the problem happened. Might go off with a reset.

Your valuable thoughts is greatly appreciated.

Thank you for all your input.
2006 206CC TU5JP4 NFU, 1.6l, 16v engine, Tiptronic, 184.000 Kilometers, Automatic A/C.

IanL
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Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by IanL »

If you did the two turns of the crankshaft without the belt being on, I can't see how damage would be avoided, but if not, you may have got away with it. Fingers crossed.

wizlinkx
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Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by wizlinkx »

IanL wrote:If you did the two turns of the crankshaft without the belt being on, I can't see how damage would be avoided, but if not, you may have got away with it. Fingers crossed.
No I didn't do that.

1. turned the crank to BDC.
2. put on the cam followers, cams.
3. turned the cams to the locking positions and locked with 8mm bolts. put back cover. tightened cam bolts.
4. Put on the new Idle pulley.
5. Put on the new tensioner.
6. then put the cam belt on with the markings to match the scribes on the cams.
7. tensioned the belt well using 6mm allen key.
8. removed the small allen key looking key.
9. made two turns of the crank. The cam scribes came back to its original position.
10. Fixed the front cam covers.
11 fixed mount, radiator and everything else I had removed.

The car starts up smoothly. But a bugging noise near the intake cam followers.
The video below gives the sound.
Also you can see smoke. That I think is because I went and put high temperature grease on the exhaust manifold bolts and the catalytic converter nuts. Realized that was stupid. Also some oil had fallen on the exhaust manifold and it is burning.

https://youtu.be/rf-olSPBjHs

In my earlier post I mentioned the check engine light was on. now it has gone.
That vibration I mentioned was because the engine was on the jack when I first started it. once I removed the jack it's gone and just normal vibration. except for that bugging sound for the intake cam followers.
2006 206CC TU5JP4 NFU, 1.6l, 16v engine, Tiptronic, 184.000 Kilometers, Automatic A/C.

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gazza82
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Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by gazza82 »

Did you store followers in oil? If not they may have dried out.
Family Fleet: ex-Cayman Green 206 CC 2.0 LE, Indigo Blue 206 1.4 HDi Hatchback, Subaru BRZ Auto, Alfa Romeo MiTo

wizlinkx
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Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:59 am
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Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by wizlinkx »

I applied lot of oil on the lobes and the bearing areas.
When I removed the cam follower covers in the beginning, I only saw oil on the lobes, didn't see them on a bath like thing.

You think I should pour oil in there?
2006 206CC TU5JP4 NFU, 1.6l, 16v engine, Tiptronic, 184.000 Kilometers, Automatic A/C.

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Capncol
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Re: Engine cranking, no start, cam sprockets not turning

Post by Capncol »

No you will be fine as the oil will pump around with engine running. you will probably find the tappets go quiet after about 20-30mins running
Cheers Col.


206cc 1.6ltr (Wifes toy)
Mercedes ML (workhorse)
Corvette C3 (my toy)

When requesting help of a technical nature, please give as much detail of the fault as possible along with details of exact model, engine size & type, gearbox, year, mileage, and any relevant work carried out to try to solve the problem to help us help you.
Better still, put the details in your signature.